CITs and Visiting Other Camps

[Flukie]

For those of you either directly involved in the CIT program or who went through a CIT program or who just know what your camp does...

Do your CITs visit another camp? If so, how do they pick that camp? How long is there trip?

With the last class (Summer 2003), they took our CITs to a camp for campers that have disabilities right in the area our camp is in. While I think it was a great experience, I really want this year's class to visit another Girl Scout camp in a separate Council so they can see what is similar or different to ours. My home camp is about 3 hours away, so the plan right now is to head there with the CITs and spend the day. However, last night I realized that our Council has a day camp that is seriously 10 minutes from that resident camp. So I was then thinking maybe we'd go from the other Council's camp to day camp, sleep there and visit them for the next day before heading home.

Then again, I wasn't sure this gives a lot of variety and maybe they should see a camp that is COMPLETELY different from our camp. The thing is, we should have no issues scheduling visits at either of the two camps I mentioned above. The resident camps CIT director hopefully is going to be one of my best friends and I've worked for the director of the day camp. And there are many difference between the camps, even if they are all Girl Scout camps. (Plus, sometimes I'm fighting an uphill battle about Girl Scouting with my CITs - they aren't current GS, so they think we should ignore that conection at camp!)

If anything, I think visiting another camp is a good thing just because my CITs seem to think it would be a waste of their time. They NEED to start realizing we aren't the only camp and that traditions do change - but camp is still camp no matter where you go. (These are the kids that told me we shouldn't add new programs to camp because then it wouldn't be THEIR camp that they know and love - when I asked if that meant we shouldn't have bought 12 new windsurfers to add windsurfing, they couldn't answer...)

[Dave]

Our CITs don't visit other camps. At least I don't think they do. I never was a CIT so I'm not sure. I do know they go on weekly field trips though.

[CAMPFRIEND]

When I was at my overnight camp, I did take my CITs to another camp to see what their program was like. The other camp then came to our camp. It was a great time for both camps and we all had a great time. We learned some new games for our camp and they learned new songs from up. It was a great day!

[audur]

We are a girl scout camp, and out CITs visit other camps. I know they visit a few - I'm not quite sure how many exactly. I know they visit another girl scout camp in our council, and they also visit a YMCA camp, because those camp's CITs also come to visit us, which is always fun. Their trip lasts a few days (around 3, I think), they stay overnight at some of the camps they visit. They always seem to have a good time, but are completely exhausted by the time they get back to our camp! I think it's a very good thing for CITs to visit other camps, because like you said, they need to know that camp is camp, no matter where you go. And I'd actually think going to a camp for kids with disabilities would be good for your CITs - it's good for everyone to broaden their horizon. Having said that, though, if you only visit one camp, I wouldn't choose that camp, simply because it's maybe too different from their camp, and there's not as much they can learn that's relevant to them right now.

[tajarbud]

Our CITs visit other camps, too. It's a good idea for the CITs to see other programs in action...they are at camp to learn and obsrve and try out their skills, aren't they? Visiting a couple of camps that may not be operated by the same agency (if camp is run by GS, YMCA, etc) are the types of visits that I think allows the CITs the best experience. :)

[Flukie]

Part of the problem last summer was I only had 2 weeks - for training and internship. This summer coming I *think* I'm getting 3 weeks - I'll know on Friday. If so, it will definitely make it easier to go somewhere else. :)

[audur]

Ah, two weeks is a very short time. Our CITs stay for 6 sessions, I believe (one or two are half-weeks, though). Or, they used to - I think they're shortening the CIT program this year so it'll only be 4 sessions

[tajarbud]

Two weeks IS a short time. Our CITs have two weeks "in training" and after successful completion, may be invited back for an internship...they also receive a stipend for this.

[Trees]

How many years is your CIT program, Fluke? At my camp with a 2-year program, we visited other camps every other year (so some girls got it their first year, some their second). At my camp with a 3 year program, we made a trip every year, but only the second-years went.

We take them to visit another GS camp, a private camp, and a special-needs camp. (When I was a CIT we visited a Boy Scout camp and a Campfire camp--none of the others remotely in our area.) We just do internet searches or follow up on personal connections, and telephone to see if they'll take us. Typically, we stay overnight at one of the camps--sometimes two. And sometimes we visit all three camps in a row, but other times it's broken up--depends on the camp schedule and how spread out the camps are.

I think visiting other camps is really, really valuable, for the reasons you say. Our girls will complain occasionally about our (strict, to them!) rules, but when they visit a camp that's more relaxed, they act all shocked and talk about how unsafe it is. I think it was especially enlightening for them to see the other GS camp; they need to know that there isn't any Best way to do things, there's just The Way We Do It. We do have to remind them from time to time, "okay, save that kind of talk for the van".

The girls this last year were so excited when the CITs from the GS camp they visited came to visit us--there was a lot of "oh, good, we can show them how it should be done"--I think they were a little surprised when the visiting CITs found plenty of our ways very strange, and not necessarily in a good way.

So yes, visiting camps=great! It also opens up their eyes to some future job options. I definitely think there are a lot of CITs out there who'd be better off working at a different camp.

[code3cadet]

They do leader ship for two weeks and then they are put in a cabin with me as cit of two weeks. they do not get to go to another camps. but they do go to sea world

[rockinsmiles]

Holy hell you guys have much more involved CIT programs than ours! The CITs at my camp can only come for 2 weeks total now. And even if they are 2 weeks back to back they still have go to home on Friday. we do make exceptions but the CIT has to ask the director and has to be good. Also they are not required to attended a training, however if they dont attented training they have to pay a full camp fee. If they do come to training they get a considerable discount. For first time CITs training is pretty basic. they go through the CPR/First Aid certification with the rest of the staff and then they have some other seperate "work shops". Returning CITs have the closest to visiting another camp. They come to "all staff" training which is where all the 4-H camps from NC come to my camp (cuz we have the biggest camp) and go through certain sessions there. Thats also the closest the staff come to visiting another camp unless they do it on there own. that is except for the archery instructor who gets his/her certification at another camp.

[Flukie]

Well, it's interesting Trees. CIT is (as you no doubt know!), by the guidelines set by GSUSA, a two part program. We run a year of CIT and a year of Intern. The problem I have with calling it Intern is the fact that our Interns think they are no longer campers. They get time off, they get to go in the staff house, they don't need a buddy. The staff also set this precedence by treating them more like staff than I think they should... I digress though!

In CIT, they get formalized training and spend the end of their session in units, working with staff and starting to lead activities. As Interns, they live full-time in the unit with the staff and work directly with the girls for a session. Interns are supposed to take on more planning time and develop their skills. According to tradition, we don't formally do any training with the Interns and they meet with their supervisor at their request. I, however, cam going to borrow them a few times throughout the sesion to check in with them individually and as a group.

So in total, they've had 4 weeks of training before they become full staff... I think we do a diservice by only having them that long... But we'll see. We're hoping that CIT is 3 weeks (two weeks of training and a week of interning) and Intern will hopefully start with 2 weeks - if you are good, you may be asked back.

[audur]

We have CIT I and II. CIT I's stay at camp session 3-8, with some weekend breaks where they have to go home (some weekends they stay at camp). They do basic training like age characteristics (I've no idea how to spell that!), they shadow counselors/specialists, they do a lot of leadership activities and they go to all other activities as well (boating, horses, swimming, art, nature...). CIT II's are - or were - considered staff. They get paid to work in the kitchen one day a week, or so. My first year, they came to camp halfway through staff training and stayed until the end of post-camp, I believe, but this year they came during session two and left before post-camp. They do get time off and they don't need buddies to travel around. They also used to be allowed to go in the staff house, but that got changed this past summer - and I believe more changes will be made this coming summer. They do a lot of internships with counselors and specialists over the summer, and I feel that most of them are more than ready to be counselors at the end of their two CIT years (there are exceptions, of course). I've been lucky enough to work closely with some of the CITs, and the CIT II's are usually just as capable as most of the staff.

I know that the council wants to change the CIT program, though, and a lot of us are upset about it - they want to shorten it, and the main reason I've heard for it is, so that it'll attract more girls, but I'm not so sure that's nescesarily a good thing... the fact that we have such an extensive CIT program means that most of the girls are there because they really, really want to be. I know that some who want to come may not be able to just because it takes up most of the summer, but I still think it works very well the way it is.

[Trees]

Yeah, Fluke, as far as I know, my area has the only three-year Girl Scout CIT programs, and I'd really rather it was two years. I think the girls get sort of burned out, and also, it's a convenient excuse for the camps to not provide excellent older-girl programming (which can be a challenge, I know). We pretty much lose any girl who's interested in camp, but not interested in CIT. It's a problem that goes on in a lot of councils... too much of the older girl programming involves them providing program for younger kids... but that's another discussion

It can be a big problem when staff treat CITs like staff. When some of the parents find out what that means, they (understandably) Do Not Like It.

[CAMPFRIEND]

For day camp I have my CIT work 5 weeks with one week of training! So want to stay and work more.

[Flukie]

I have the problem of getting CITs! We have a strong sailing program at our camp - so a lot of our girls come to sail (Quote of the summer, "Um, maybe you don't know this, Fluke, but we're a sailing camp, NOT a Girl Scout camp..." Hahahaha!). Getting them to take 3 weeks off of sailing to do CIT can be a challenge. :)

I can see how three years could be a challenge to work with. And I do understand the older girl programming issue too - when I was a camper, my home camp only had CIT for older girls. I really wanted to do CIT, but when I got a bit older and they changed the programming, I was jealous of what was offered! :)

[audur]

I think we have a pretty awesome program for older campers, and it's pretty varied. I know if *I* were 16, I'd have trouble deciding what to sign up for. We have a lot of different trips (canoeing, biking, backpacking, horseback trips and more - the other camp in the council offers llama trips and kayaking), leadership programs (CIT, PA training (which actually wasn't very well done last year), and general leadership programs), horse programs and art programs... but we still have trouble getting girls to sign up. Last summer, about half of our trips were cancelled due to few girls signing up, and a lot of the trips only had like 3 or 4 campers. Which is incredibly sad, because the girls who are just a couple of years younger are still very excited about camp. This summer, I had a two-week mountain biking unit where I only had four campers, and a two-week leadership unit where I had seven... it was fun, and I got to know my campers very, very well, but I'm still sad that so few girls are signing up.

[camper]

our CA's don't visit other camps just to see them, but every age group in camp goes to other camps for intercamp games and wayne county tournaments. at the end of the day, by the time it's time to to go back to our camp they usually can't wait to come back and do things our way again!!! lol!

[Marzz]

When I was a CIT, our program was for 4 weeks. We did three weeks at one camp, and one week at the other camp in our council. This was really good because back then, there was a huge rivalry between the two camps and it forced us to see the good in the "other" camp. The CIT program is now only 3 weeks, and I don't know if they still have them visit the other camp. Every camp is different, even when operated by the same organization (or council), it's important for the kids to see how camp is different, yet the same, no matter where you go.

We have a two year program as well. Before a camper becomes a CIT, they can do a 2 year program called "LEAP" which is sort of like CIT in training.

[runrachrunn]

Our camp doesn't visit other camps, but the CITS do take a 5 day river rafting trip, where they sleep in tents, do bonding things, etc. Apparently it's a very intense experience, and half-way through the summer, it seems to bring the group together as a whole.